I had stated (probably with less grace than I could have) that I had not witnessed the problems they claim happen "within SGM" at my local church. I said other things, which are available at the link above-- let the reader judge their validity. To the contrary, every teaching I have heard, and every discussion I have held with every person I have run into at my local church, has been quite the opposite of pretty much every (if not every) negative thing the folk at that website claim to have experienced.
Oh I am soooo thrilled I stumbled on this one post…. Thanks soooo much Ellie
I went to the blog to see if this guy was a shoe-in for Leadership… I don’t call it the Hair Club for Men just for fun. (I couldn’t find a pic) but he is defiantly hardcore Johnathan Edwards type… So he comes to SGM leadership discussions with Kevlar on—you know mostly bullet proof for SGM inspection.
I love this… He is dismissing “survivors” because he’s never had a disagreement with the leaders. So what is the logic here? Since it’s never happened to me it just CANT be true. Why, how much better a judge could there be but Moi?
I’m gonna have to burst this ostrich logic bubble.
There are 5 reasons why people don’t have “conflict” with the Hair Club for Men.
The most obvious reason: You are an ostrich and avoid conflict at all costs.
Psssstt… just keep your head down. It will be ok. Not all conflicts are created equal:
Truth: On the outside the Hair Club for Men treats most disagreements like a preference for Strawberry vs Vanilla Ice Cream. They didn’t care about your disagreement. It really is that simple. The nature of your objection didn’t rate any action in their mind. They didn’t have a vested interest in the outcome of your objection/disagreement. It doesn’t matter the content of the conversation if they don’t think what you said registers on the “So what test.” They will smile and nod, and let you think whatever you want—sort of. (much more to this point below) Not all critics are created equal:
The vast percentage of people who say “I’ve disagreed with the pastors an nothing ever happened to me,” are men. Women who come to the leaders with doctrinal objections are dismissed out of hand. And women who come before leaders who are not toeing the submissive mark at home (often defined by abusive or spineless men) and are railroaded into the veritable doctrinal box. It doesn’t matter how polite the Hair Club for Men’s words, women daring to enter the lofty arena of THEOLOGY are not qualified. Be a woman in a discussion about authority, practice, or doctrine and learn what the word Condescension means; they will steeple their fingers and look down there long pious nose and tisk tisk tisk as a mere female tries to influence their great minds about Sound Doctrine. Not all critics are created equal:
Personal success makes them pause. No matter their protest to my words the Hair Club for Men, venerates economic and business success. (When was the last time you saw a Master Automotive Technician “commended” from the pulpit? Now compare to the last time you saw a New Doctor or a New Lawyer?) As long as your life is seemingly empty of what they consider to be relational or moral issues they will tend towards giving the benefit of the doubt. So, the closer you are to being a life success as defined by money and its accoutrements, the more they will pause any real conflict. But woe to you if they find out what really lurks under the façade of your life. No amount of personal success will deter them then… indeed that very success will become the leaver of their greatest criticism. Woe to YOU!
(As a sub-point to the above) the less impressed they are with your personal/professional achievements ppppfffffft… You are not even worth an honorable mention in the objection category… because God opposes the proud don’t you know, and your lack of success makes it evident that you are on Gods shi—opps displeasure list. Not all critics are created equal:
The hard truth is they don’t deem YOU a threat. In other words you don’t impress them enough to merit conflict. But once you do disagree … you are on the list. They do NOT forget that you offered a contrary position. The moment you do they are keeping track. ANY objection to their Authority, Practice, or Doctrine is taken with utter seriousness. (Further thoughts from above) Never delude yourself into thinking you had a private conversation with a leading member of the Hair Club for Men. It didn’t happen. If you offered any objection, anywhere, any time, for those three categories the entire leadership team knows about the conversation. And they are NOT amused. They evaluate how to handle YOU based on these criteria:
1. Are you in any leadership position or aspire to same?
2. Do you “serve?”
3. Do you have the ability to influence people?
If the answer to the first two question is no, they do nothing. They have learned that most objectors will drift off into obscurity if they don’t give the conflict any credence.
The last question is the real litmus that precludes real conflict. (i.e. showing you the door as fast as they can raise their foot to your butt)
Here is the short answer to YOU
not having pastoral conflict. You are not as effective in intellectual disagreement as you would like to think.
I know… I know… You talked to a pastor for an hour and had a “deep theological debate”
You walked out of the office and thought you had engaged great minds with great ideas and the pastor saw some of your points and maybe you got through, even just a little bit.
You went home and told your wife how so very blunt you were and what a great champion of truth you were.
>snicker, snicker, snicker<
Ok… enough of the charade. Forget that myth of blunt dissent you rehears in your mind in the quite moments. Let’s be candid. Come on. We are all anonymous here;you can fess up to the Ethernet.
What did you really say in this great rift of intellectual dispute?
How often did you confess your own pride and arrogance? How often did you caveat and hedge? How many times did you pay homage to the great leaders of SGM and their daunting task at defending sound doctrine? How often did your eyes glaze over when they started chanting quod ubique, quod simper, quod ab omnibus
as their definition of Orthodoxy? How obsequious were you truly? Did you post your own version of Disputation on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences
or was it more like a Rodney King Theo-missive—“can’t we all just get along?”
I am positive that by the time you got done with your disagreement it was so watered down with PDI/CLC/SGM speak that it rated on the order of “I like strawberry ice cream but you like vanilla >sigh< I guess well, just agree to disagree.”
If you really want to see what disagreement looks like with PDI/CLC/SGM walk up to robin boysvert, or Vicar Charles Joseph and say, “Women really do have the ability to understand the details of theology,” and THEN turn and tell ten other people while they watch.
Hahahahahahh aahhahahahahahah hahahahahah….
And I’m not done:
After he looks down his nose and steeples his fingers and tells you that you are having a deleterious effect on people, and suggests that maybe you should start your own church … tell him his Christian practice is WRONG. Tell him you have no obligation to follow him as he follows Christ. Tell him he is WRONG about women. Make sure you say it like that. Make sure you leave no room to doubt that you are in fundamental opposition to his authority to declare women unfit to engage ideas. Never once hedge. Never once dissemble. Oh bold man that you are, never once pay homage to Vicar Charles Joseph I.
Hehehehe…. Hahahahaha ahahahahah….
Then come back to me and tell me how great and humble and magnanimous the Hair Club for Men really is when it comes to disagreement. And I’m betting about that time you will wish that Gandalf was real and could use that staff to kick some booty.